[Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

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[Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 2:53 am

Umekiko

I've been meaning to put this topic up for a while. I want to make a definitive reference on what the different patterns on kimono and kanzashi are for each month, since a lot of posts I see are "Help! Is this seasonally correct?!" or things of that nature.

I would LOVE any help on this! Please, comment, add ideas! I know very little. Also, please tell me if it is KIMONO, KANZASHI or BOTH! I can't tell if you just say "April is cherry blossoms", for example.

[Update] Okay! Here's a beta-list. I still REALLY REALLY need your help, guys! Huge thanks to GoldenPhoenix.

JANUARY
Kanzashi - Ume, Bamboo and Pine, Special New Year Themes

FEBRUARY
Kanzashi - Plum Blossom, Daffodil

MARCH
Kanzashi - Rape Blossom, Silver/Gold Butterflies, Narcissus, Peach blossom, Peony

APRIL
Kanzashi - Cherry blossoms, Silver/Gold/Mizubiki/Silk butterflies, Bonbori lanterns

MAY
Kanzashi - Wisteria, Blue-Flag Iris, Silver/Gold Butterflies

JUNE
Kanzashi - Hydrangea, Willow, Pinks, Umbrellas, Water, Dew-drops

JULY
Kanzashi - Dew-on-Grass, Round or Folding Fans, Fireworks, Pinks, Dragonflies, Butterflies, Pampas Grass, Special Festival ornaments

AUGUST
Kanzashi - Silver/Pink backed Pampas Grass, Morning Glories, Fans, Pinks

SEPTEMBER
Kanzashi - Chinese Bellflowers, Bush Clover, Patrina

OCTOBER
Kanzashi - Chrysanthemum

NOVEMBER
Kanzashi - Turning Maple Leaves

DECEMBER
Kanzashi - Maneki Tags, Rice Cakes, Mochibana

NEW YEAR'S PERIOD
Kanzashi - Unhusked Rice and Dove

Winter Kimono
Plum, bamboo, pine combo
Plum
Camelia
Snow covered bamboo
Snow covered pine
Snow
Snowflakes
Bare trees
Bare branches

Spring Kimono
Sakura
Falling Sakura Petals
Butterflies
Peonies
Wysteria
Magnolia
Irises
Daffodils
Narcissus
New bamboo shoots
Orchids
Peacock

Summer Kimono
Butterflies
Peonies
Grasses (green)
Willow
Pinks
Birds
Running water
Fireworks
Roses
Dragonflies
Thistle
Fans (???)
Koi (???)
Clam catching baskets (???)

Autumn Kimono
Chrysanthemum
Turning Maple Leaves
Grasses (brown/dried)
Falling leaves
Bundled bare branches
Bellflower

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 2:56 am

Bai Mianxi

For what it's worth, a list of words by season/event in classic Japanese poetry:

http://renku.home.att.net/500ESWd.html

It isn't necessarily entirely applicable, but so far it seems to correspond with the themes listed here, and I've seen a lot of references to poetry and clothing seasonality that seem to imply they go together. (Choosing combinations for kosode/kimono based on famous poems all the sophisticates would be expected to "get" the references to.) At the very least, it's a heap of concepts + japanese terms to work with.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 2:56 am

Desu

I have evidence of another type of kanzashi motif: omodaka, or water plantain.  I will have to check my postcard/photograph when I get home, but I believe it's a June motif.  I also have a postcard of a Pontocho geiko with omodaka motifs on her kimono, obi and uchiwa.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 2:57 am

Desu

Maybe omodaka is a July motif instead? Her obi-age has a dew-on-grass motif on it.

Image


Here's the photo:

Image

It's a little hard to tell with this one, but I think she's wearing an omodaka kanzashi. I'll have to dig up the big scan to make sure. Does anyome recognize the plant type on her kimono? It looks like some sort of water weed.

And the geiko:

Image


I found another kanzashi type going through my postcards here: katabami, aka wood sorrel.

Mon: http://www.kameda-lab.org/private/famil ... tabami.gif
Real life: http://www.edu.city.hashimoto.wakayama. ... tabami.jpg

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 2:59 am

naeelah

Just adding paulownia (however you spell it - kiri) to autumn motifs. Also, Japanese ivy which I think is summer and fall, but I seem to recall seeing it more on summer kimono. (Not sure, someone help me out.)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:00 am

GoldenPhoenix
Kujaku wrote:
Desu wrote:Maybe omodaka is a July motif instead?  Her obi-age has a dew-on-grass motif on it.
It's a little hard to tell with this one, but I think she's wearing an omodaka kanzashi.  I'll have to dig up the big scan to make sure.  Does anyome recognize the plant type on her kimono?  It looks like some sort of water weed.

I found another kanzashi type going through my postcards here: katabami, aka wood sorrel.

Mon: http://www.kameda-lab.org/private/famil ... tabami.gif
Real life: http://www.edu.city.hashimoto.wakayama. ... tabami.jpg
Wood sorrels! We get those around my house all the time. :D I put omodaka in both Spring and Summer sections with a (???).

Hm.. The best I can see on her kimono might be a water weed, but maybe a creeper vine? (like ivy, but this is obviously NOT ivy!)

Do you know where wood sorrel goes?

Thanks so much, Desu! This is wonderful!!!
I found some info on Wood Sorrels here:  http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Co ... od_sorrel

Common wood sorrel is a plant from the genus Oxalis, common in most of Europe and parts of Asia. It flowers for a few months during the spring, with small white flowers with pink streaks. Red or violet flowers also occur rarely. The binomial name is Oxalis acetosella, because of its sour taste.

The leaflets are made up by three heart-shaped leaves, folded through the middle. The stalk is red/brown, and during the night or when it rains both flowers and leaves contract.

Historically, people have extracted calcium oxalate, or "sal acetosella" from the plant, through boiling. It is slightly toxic, as oxalic acid is known to interfere with food digestion.

Another common wood sorrel is Oxalis montana, a North American species found from New England and Nova Scotia to Wisconsin and Manitoba. It is similar to the species described above, but the petals are noticeably notched.

The common wood sorrel is sometimes referred to as a shamrock (due to its three-leaf clover-like motif) and given as as gift on St. Patrick's Day.
Like clovers, it probably grows in areas with low grasses; meadows, fields, roadsides and maybe even ground cover in woodlands. There is probably also a lot of variation in flower colour between the many different species of sorrels.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:00 am

Dschinny

Another kanzashi calendar:

works with very fine silk
http://homepage3.nifty.com/tazu/kanzashi/index.html

creative take (looking is for free)
http://www.japanartya.com/thumbnail.asp?cid=386

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:01 am

Iyolin

Kikkou-mouyou (tortiseshell pattern) is aupicious, so I don't think it has a season. Geometrics usually don't, and IIRC, kikkou-mouyou means 'long life'.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:02 am

meijimari

General references to start...

Following the Japanese matsuri/seasonal calendar of popular culture:

http://www.jun-gifts.com/others/cultura ... lendar.htm

I enjoy them as a beginning to look-sees into the living culture.

A very good guidebook, "A Japanese Touch for All Seasons" lists great motifs seasonally with seasonal dates, suggestions on the lunar calendar observations.

Here's some (will check and edit according to what was already posted)

January
kagami mochi
daidai bitter orange  - 'generation after generation'
persimmons - joy
lobster - long life
takara bune - treasure ship of seven gods of good fortune
miki-kuchi - bamboo decorations offered with sake to god of the New Year
Noshi - decorative white tie
Kadu matsu - bamboo and pine decoration
Twining willows
Snow rabbits
Hana Fuda (card games)
Kites
Battledores and shuttlecock (games)


February (Setsuban February 3/4)
Soybean tossing
Out with Demons!
Risshun (First day of Spring, February 4/5)
Plum Blossums
Uguisu or bush warbler

Mid-February
Camellia

March (Keitchitsu, 6/6)
First herbs
Daphane

Shunbun (vernal equinox, March 20/21)
Butterflies emerge
Buddhist sutras
Doll Festival
Mugwort

April (Seimei 5/6)
Cherry Blossums (Hana Matsuri - can also be May 8 according to some districts)

Azaleas
Rhodendrons
Deutzias
Magnolias

May  (Hachiju/hachiya, 2)
Tea picking
Boy's Day (Old festival, 5)
Sweet Flag
Carp
Kachiwa mochi on oak leaf


Here's a start and will add more later if people are interested.  The Treasure ship, for instance, and noshi (decorative ties) will appear on obis and paper and other seasonal decorations, as well as kimono designs...

I've only been researching floral and seasonal motifs according to certain matsuri and the lunar calendar...the seasonal motifs might be interesting because it adds 'texture/feel' to the wearing of what works for a design..

for instance, in Tanabata, the great heat gives thirst, so the softness and fluid colors of water suggests coolness...yet there is celebration of wishes, love, the Milky Way and thanks for skill in weaving/sewing; at the turn of after high summer, the thoughts turn to autumn grasses and the yearning for persimmon... and the reverend ancestors are also visited...so perhaps checking through lunar calendar and matsuri festival references will assist on listing the motifs.

Regards,

Meijimari

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:03 am

Bai Mianxi

1. First thing that might help is the Season, Color, and Pattern Resources thread. It's full of links to the things folks here have been able to find.

2. For identifying floral and other motifs, I generally turn to this book: An Illustrated Encyclopedia of Japanese Family Crests. The labels are in kanji on one side of the page, which is tough to read without a dictionary, but they're in kana on the other, and most of the words are pretty easy to figure out--there are pictures right there, after all, and you'll find you know most of them already. (Sakura, ume, momo, tsuru...)

3. Some flowers get dangles, some don't, and the flowers themselves are month-specific.

4. If the fan has recognizable motifs on it, and the motifs are seasonal, then the fan itself is seasonal.

5. You can buy stretch tabi without kohaze (clasps). However, they aren't that much lighter in weight. And, strictly speaking, they're not appropriate with geta at all.

--Bai

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:08 am

Kohaku-chan

I'm a visual type, and I had some free time to spare, so I borrowed
- this link: http://renku.home.att.net/500ESWd.html
- the listings already on this thread,
- The Ichiroya website (I'm sure they wont mind us borrowing from their huge image library)
- and Wikipedia
and I thought I'd make a list of visual seasonal images on kimonos. (I don't think we've ever got round to doing this before... please feel free to delete if I'm majorly putting my foot in it!!)
So here goes...
Spring:
BUTTERFLIES
Image
CAMELLIA
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camellia
COLTS
Image
PEACOCKS
Image
PHEASANTS
Image
KOI SWIMMING UPSTREAM
Image
SWALLOW
Image
SAKURA (April)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakura
UGUISU (BUSH WARBLER)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_warbler
WILLOW (late spring)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willow
WISTERIA (may)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wisteria

Next stop... summer! Hope you like! (bows)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:08 am

Kohaku-chan

Here goes... surprisingly lots for this one...

SUMMER
PAULOWNIA
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paulownia
CORMORANT FISHING (random but true!)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cormorant_fishing
EGGPLANTS (awww)
Image
FIREFLIES
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fireflies
FIREWORKS (thanks to whoever owns the photo from the Geisha section!)
Image
IRIS
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iris_%28plant%29
LILY
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lily
LOTUS
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nelumbo
ORCHID
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orchid
PEONY (BOTAN)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peony
ROSE
Image
SUNFLOWER
Image
TACHIBANA (Mandarin orange blossom)
Image
THISTLE
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thistle
UCHIWA (round fans)
Image
WATERFALLS (I guess they just make you feel cool!)
Image

Few! Next stop Autumn...

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:09 am

Kohaku-chan

Part 3...

AUTUMN
CRICKETS (this is really late summer early autumn)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cricket_%28insect%29
DRAGONFLY (ditto late summer early autumn)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragonfly
DEER (baby deer are summer apparantly...)
Image
GEESE (can actually be spring or autumn... think migration - going out or coming back!)
Image
SUMO (huh? I here you ask? I know, for Kimono I'd say it was all season... but according to haiku tradition...)
Image
KAKI (PERSIMMON) - the fruit!
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persimmon
QUAIL
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quail
CHINESE BELLFLOWER
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_bellflower
BUSHCLOVER
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_clover
KIKU (CHRYSANTHEMUM)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysanthemum
MOMIJI (red maple leaves... if they are just turning it should be late summer, but red are supposedly for around November time...)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momiji

Back with Winter in a jiffy! (Can't believe I just said jiffy...)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:10 am

Kohaku-chan

WINTER
HAWKS
Image
MANDARIN DUCKS
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandarin_duck
UME (PLUM BLOSSOM) - late winter - February
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plum_blossom

So few! Any more ideas people? Oh well I guess I can include New Year here too... Most new year themes (except maybe the games) are also for good luck and fortune, so I think they can be worn too at most celebrations!
Games first:
BATTLEDORE
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battledore
UTA-GARUTA (HYAKUNIN ISSHU)
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uta-garuta
TEMARI
Image
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temari_%28toy%29
Good luck symbols
LOBSTER (long life)
Image
TREASURE SHIP
Image

That's about it for now! I've bound to have missed some... why don't the rest of you contribute? I hope this is of some help... and it kept me busy for a happy while!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:11 am

naitsuusha

Kohaku-chan, thanks for the great pictoral seasonal pattern guide! It's been a great help to me!

However, I have a quick question.

Is asahona a seasonal pattern or is it good all year round? It's my favorite pattern and I have quite a few items with asahona and was wondering if I was restricted in when to where it...

Thanks a lot!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:11 am

Kohaku-chan

Do you mean the symmetrical "hemp leaves" pattern asanoha?:

Image

If so, I had a look around and I found this information from this website:
http://www.mikworks.com/originalwork/asanoha/
(confirmed on a few other places I looked):
"Asanoha (hemp leaf)" is one of the most popular Japanese traditional patterns. This pattern was named Asanoha because the shape literally looks like a hemp leaf. In spite of its name, however, the pattern did not borrow motif from a plant. It is a geometric design with six diamond-shaped patterns arranged in a radial manner. Identifying the hemp which grows well with the growth of a baby, the pattern has been often used for swaddling clothes."

According to Wikipedia hemp should be planted in April and harvested 14 weeks after - so I assume the leaves will be in their full glory by July. But I think, bearing in mind that it's a geometrical pattern and the meaning associated with it - I would say all year round is good! :)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:12 am

PleasureDroid

Maple leave question.

I have a kimono that's off white with blue maple leaves on... as I remember a disscution about coloured maple leaves being not only autumn I'm now a bit confused.. I know red and orange are autumn tho, but I have seen green and purple on summer kimonos for example...
would I get away with having that kimono with the blue maple leaves on in early September? It's lined, but I'm going to wear it in the UK and they are not famous for their warmth so I expect cold weather and rain..
Also, white maple leaves on an mustard/burnt orange/aubergine purple background is too much autumn for september?

last question. remember reading some where that the obi can be a little before season right? Like to anticipate whats coming. Am I totally wrong on this?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:12 am

bebmochi

You're definitely right that you can choose to anticipate the season in your kimono and obi. In that case, if a lined kimono is correct for the weather, and the maple leaves aren't literal autumn colors, in my opinion you can wear it in September.
September is a transitional period between the green maple leaves of summer and the red maple leaves of autumn, anyways. Why not wear blue ones? :)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:13 am

Ayaychika

Hmm, I feel a little confused. I was looking up paulownia since I just got a kurotomesode featuring large gold and silver paulownia. Somewhere in the posts above, one person mentioned it as autumn but another mentioned it as summer... To add a little more confusion, my tomesode is definetly awase, and very heavy awase at that.

Can anyone clarify?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:13 am

Kohaku-chan

Paulownia turns out to be more complicated than I'd originally thought! In the pictures above I included it in the summer motifs as according to the haiku seasons it is related to summer, but...
If you look on Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paulownia
It says that it actually flowers in early spring and is followed by a fruit containing thousands of seeds. But...
It also says that in the card game hanafuda it represents December - which would make sense with your tomesode.
So who knows!!! I'm thouroughly confused. :???:

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:14 am

moonblossom

Yay, time for another silly question. Would a koinobori motif be for April (anticipatory) and May (literal) or is it something I could theoretically get away with whenever? It's so cute. :coy:

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:14 am

bebemochi

Kiri is prettymuch regarded as being an autumnal motif, despite its actual natural habits I guess, haha. Ayaychika, I would wear your tomesode in fall. You can probably stretch it into early winter, too.

Mon are always considered seasonless, because they don't have to do with motif, but rather with family emblems.

moonblossom, I think you're prettymuch out of luck. Koi no bori is, without a doubt, a May only motif, just like Hina Matsuri items are March only. (In fact, some really strict oba-chan might say only the week of, and never once it's over.) Motifs having to do with a specific holiday are really small in their wearability scope.
Of course, you can gauge the situation and see if you think you can get away with it, but this is the sort of thing where if you run into a Japanese person, they are gonna wonder. It'd be like wearing a jack-o-lantern teeshirt in July.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:16 am

loreamar

I was searching tachibana citrus and then I end in a web very interesting about plants of japan, by months, bilingual and lots of nice pictures!!!!

http://studiesofplantsandwildlife.blogspot.com/

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:17 am

chissprincess

Are any of the following flowers ever used as kimono motifs? And if so, do any of you have any pictures of them floating around or know where I could find some pictures? I think my new komon has some of these flowers on it, but I could only compare my kimono to pictures of the real flowers so I'm still a bit unsure. There's at least one flower on there that I've decided could be three or four different things (the fact that the entire thing is in shades of purple, white, and peach doesn't help my confusion either...). Anyway, motifs I'm looking for:

- Azalea/tsutsuji
- Wild rose/yamabuki
- Peach blossoms/momo no hana
- Primrose/sakurasoo
- Deutzia flower/u no hana

Thank you!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:38 am

Peccantis

I managed to find some pictures for you.

First, a peach T-shirt (My grand "momo no hana" search returned no kitsuke items...):
Image

Yamabuki gave a drawing an an obi!
Image
Image

and atzalea this:
Image

Sakurasoo / primrose on a kimono:
Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:38 am

Quat

Is there a difference between peach and plum blossom patterns? Unless you see them used in obvious 'late' or 'early' spring motives (where they're listed in the 500 essentials), are they presented differently in any way? I just realized on more than one occasion I've probably thought what was a plum may have been a peach...

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:39 am

Peccantis

I'm everything but a master of telling patterns, but I could say this:

Sakura
- easiest to tell apart from the others
- colour ranges from white to pink, but a faint pink is very typical
- petals have a "dent" in the tip, making any rounder petals look like hearts
- petal overall shape ranges from very round to rather narrow ovals
- the stem between the flower base and the branch is long
- flowers are in clusters (as berries will be small there can be many growing from one point)
- branches are likely to be willowy and sleek
- appropriate for especially young girls
Image

Ume
- if it's a strong red, it's ume
- colour ranges from white to almost wine, another typical colour is a strong pink
- petals are round, never narrow ovals (?)
- flowers grow almost directly from the branch in clusters of maximum of 3 at a time
- branches are very likely to be gnarly and graphical with strong features
- appropriate for almost any lady (I have heard plum is a symbol of faithfulness, and faithful love), a dignified pattern and not as "height of youth"... then again I have seen it on a dignified young girl also, in a manga... I believe the author knows her symbolism as she had also made a highly iki outfit for a character... She was wearing Shoo-chiku (pine and bamboo) without the bai (ume, plum) because she was the plum, bearing the name Umeko :lovelove
Image
Image

Momo
- think pink: peach is not as faint as cherry and not as strong as plum
- flowers grow as with ume straight from the branch, without a long stem in-between
- I suppose there is a specialised way to depict momo in a stylised manner: it would be most like a circle with added petals. I have added a picture below to illustrate.
- a youthful pattern, so it might be
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... and if it looks like sakura on steroids it might as well be almond :wink:
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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:40 am

Franciele

What season would this obi be for? I thought it might be summer since to me it sort of looks like there is water but there is too many flowers to be a river....

Image

Image

http://www.toku.co.jp/yahoo/img.asp?tno=81051007&sno=9

Thank you!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:40 am

loreamar

Franciele - It´s all seasons, the obi have momiji, kiku = autumn; tsubaki, matsu, ume = winter. It´s awase too.

I also have a request, what kind of flowers are?

I see violets but there are more than that...
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Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:42 am

Projecthikari

I never understood this:
"It is a faux pas to wear a sakura kimono to a sakura viewing party."
Why is this? It just makes a 1000.1% sense to me to wear a Sakura kimono around Sakura trees.

Maybe it's just something I'm not seeing... I mean, what else would you wear?? :D

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:42 am

Tahanala

I think it would be overdoing it. Maybe you are supposed to let the real sakura steal the show at hanami, and wearing some yourself would be demanding that people admire you as much as the trees, since you wear the same adornments.
If my memory is good, one should also wear patterns whose seasonality is a bit in advance. I guess it shows that your sensibility to the seasonal changes is also internal and personal, and not a mere reaction to whatever you see poking out from your window.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:43 am

bebemochi

I'd like to add, about wearing sakura to hanami, is that it's just too obvious. It would be like wearing a teeshirt with a lobster on it to a Red Lobster restaurant.

Although, that having been said, and I think everyone and their mom has pointed this out at some time or another on this board, you will see plenty of pictures of people wearing sakura kimono to hanami or fireworks yukata to hanabi and the like. For one, those may be the only kimono / yukata they own. And for two, well, like I said, it's sort of an obvious thing to do, so you're going to see people doing it.

It's really up to you if you want to wear a sakura kimono to hanami.

(But you won't catch me doing it, haha.)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:43 am

Kotone

According to one of my kimono books, Kimono and Living (着物と暮らす), while one should be giving the Sakura the limelight during Hanami (according to many sources and many people I've asked). If you're going to do it, this is how you do it (From Kimono and Living):
Sakura BUDS = Images of buds, and fully open Sakura
Sakura BEGINNING TO BLOOM = Images of fully open Sakura
Sakura at FULL BLOOM = Images of petals begining to fall
Sakura PETALS FALLING = No full images of Sakura in any stage, except for a SINGLE PETAL obidome, or netsuke (/cell phone charm)
着物の柄は季節とコラブルーションをする楽しみがあります。実際の季節よりもほんの少し先取には梅を、桜の季節には桜、というように合わせます。
江戸時代、桜の季節が近つくと、町を歩く女性の着物に桜の絵柄や色が多くなり、町中に春の季節感が漂っていたのかしら。想像すると、それは美しい眺めだったでしようね。
桜の花描き方、種類もさまざま。ピンクの濃い八重桜の好きな人、 白いソメイヨシンが好きな人もいます。桜の柄を着物に帯にするか、小物にあしらうか、色だけで花を表現すかは見せ所。黒い振袖の下に満開の桜の長じゅばんという演出や、 半衿にたっぷり桜のししゅうをするも華やはですてきだす。
着物仲間がいたら、 毎回テーマを決めて集まれば、 楽しさ倍増ですね。
From the aforementioned book. My translating would've been a nightmare, so someone else pleases?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 4:22 am

Chissprincess

*cry* I still can't figure out some of these flowers...can someone help me out a bit?

Okay, first this, which I think might be camellia:

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And then these, which have me so confused I don't know which was is up.

In this picture, I can't identify the white and peach-colored flowers. I think the purple ones are plum, though:

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Here, I'm pretty sure the big flower on the left is an orchid, but what are the smaller ones to the right? They look a little bit like pinks:

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And are these big things peonies?

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No idea what these are. Maybe camellia again? Though I also found some peach blossom pictures and feel like these might be peach blossom too:

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If it helps, the kimono is lined (in bright salmon-pink no less).

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 4:23 am

Kotone

Picture 1: Peony
Picture 2: Peach and white = Camellia, purpley color behind with VERY round petals = ume
Picture 3: Large purple flower = Orchid (only one I'm not sure of), small flower with jagged edged petals = Dianthus
Picture 4: Large flowers = Peony
Picture 5: Purple flowers = Peach blossom

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 4:23 am

Peccantis
Kotone wrote:(...)
着物の柄は季節とコラブルーションをする楽しみがあります。実際の季節よりもほんの少し先取には梅を、桜の季節には桜、というように合わせます。
江戸時代、桜の季節が近つくと、町を歩く女性の着物に桜の絵柄や色が多くなり、町中に春の季節感が漂っていたのかしら。想像すると、それは美しい眺めだったでしようね。
桜の花描き方、種類もさまざま。ピンクの濃い八重桜の好きな人、 白いソメイヨシンが好きな人もいます。桜の柄を着物に帯にするか、小物にあしらうか、色だけで花を表現すかは見せ所。黒い振袖の下に満開の桜の長じゅばんという演出や、 半衿にたっぷり桜のししゅうをするも華やはですてきだす。
着物仲間がいたら、 毎回テーマを決めて集まれば、 楽しさ倍増ですね。
From the aforementioned book. My translating would've been a nightmare, so someone else pleases?
I'll give it a try.

"Choosing patterns of kimono according to the seasons is fun. Patterns such as sakura and ume should be used only a bit before their actual seasons. During Edo period, just before the sakura season, women would wear sakura patterns on their kimono in the streets and the feeling of spring spread throughout the town. It must have been a lovely view. There were also many ways of depicting sakura flowers on kitsuke. There are people that like deep pink layered sakura and people who like simple white sakura. There are also other places to display sakura patterns in kitsuke, such as obi; the colour of sakura may also suggest the flower in items such as komono. In jubans made for use underneath kuro-furisode, the han-eri might be filled with brilliant embroidery showing sakura in full bloom. If you have kitsuke friends, you could decide themes for your meetings to double the fun."

(I suppose it should have been "コラブレーション" since "コラブルーション" becomes "collab Roussillion"...)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 4:24 am

Marukami

Do obi follow the same season rules as kimono??

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 4:25 am

Peccantis
Murakami wrote:Do obi follow the same season rules as kimono??
Oh yes. Primroses are spring no matter what they are on, kanzashi, kimono or obi.

But I do think it's thought to be geiko-iki to wear obi with patterns that are a bit more pre-season than those on the kimono.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 4:26 am

Strawberry Kimono

I got myself a kimono magazine recently. I didn't really know what to expect, and got it sort of on a whim but what I got was a real kimono 'vogue'! The magazine is from Winter 2008.

Few of the pages had obi suggestions for... I'm guessing special days in winter, so I decided to share. :)

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December 12 - not sure if it's for Dec 12 exclusively, or just a suggestion for December in general, or for Dec 12-31.

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January 1 - again, same thing as above.

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February 2 - is there something special going on in Japan on Feb 2?

Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:07 am

bebemochi

It's just the month. Each number has the kanji for "getsu," or month, after it. The individual obi are numbered so you can look them up in the shopping section at the end of the book, just like most fashion magazines. :)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:10 am

Kira M. M.

So I have ume.... bamboo... and what is in the background?
And does that make this spring? Even with the bamboo??

Also, is there a seasonality with animals? And do some animals suite some plants better then others? -- I have tried to find information on this, but it hasn't been consistant...

Image

These are other sections of the bolt.. in honesty I was hoping would be obi material.

http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu10 ... 1240768789
With daffodils and cysanthimums (kiku)??

http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu10 ... 1240768904

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:10 am

Tahanala

What you have on the pic displayed in your post are bamboo, kikyo (Chinese Bellflower, the one maiko wear as September kanzashi,) and hagi (Bush clover, sometimes replaces kikyo for senior maiko.)

Other than that, yes, kiku, ume, and suisen (daffodils.) It is multi-seasonal indeed.

Butterflies are usually associated with spring, carps with summer, dragonflies, fireflies, and cicada with late summer, bunnies and deers with autumn... Chidori are both a summer motif (Water! Coolness!) and a winter auspicious one.

Here's a link to seasonal themes in traditional poetry.

I think that apart from kikyo, nearly all your flowers fit into the awase part of the year.
Now that I think of it, I don't see any late spring flowers either: sakura, fuji, tachibana, botan, etc... but they might figure on other parts of the bolt. Because of that, it might be difficult to wear it in the spring-hitoe season, especially with its autumnal colours.
You could also half-line it to keep it cool while looking proper, I guess.
(Don't think of the lining part as a pain in the a**, but as a challenge! :P )

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:12 am

Kira M. M.

So now that I have a SLIGHT clue on the kimono...

this is described as flower lozenge pattern.
I am thinking geometric... and any season....

http://www.japanese-antiques.jp/eBayite ... %20(2).JPG


and this one with the kiri... aren't kiri a symbol of the royal family?

http://kimono-wholesale.com/kwpho/kwo72/o721019.jpg

as my houmongi is lined, I am looking for something that would suit.. anything BUT summer...
http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu10 ... 1240794158

:]
Tahanala.. maybe you could just tutor me. I feel quiet the novice.

and the kiri.. would work with both.... the one to be made.. and the other.

BTW... would bending grass be fall??

and I can never ask just one question....

http://kyotoantiques.sakura.ne.jp/shouhin/14568/4.JPG
another fall??

Thank you so much for your answers... and help.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:14 am

Tahanala

I think I remember that grasses covered with dew-drops (tsuyushiba) are representative of summer, bt I'm not sure about plain blades. I'd say autumn, as part of the 7 herbs of autumn (no, not the "7 words") but I could be wrong.

I'm stumped by these last flowers. The petals look like sakura, but the leaves certainly don't. It might be nadeshiko (pinks) with fringed petals, in which case I've seen them from June to September.
If I were you, I would check the "Bad service" thread in the Marketplace forum, several persons -including myself- have never received their package from this seller. I had ordered from them several times without any problem in the past, but they proved most unhelpful when I emailed them about the loss this time. It could very well be a coincidence and a one-time accident, but I'd be careful if I were you to use a tractable shipping option with insurance. Their beige items have also turned out to be distinctly green several times, so do double-check the colour with them before bidding!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:16 am

Tahanala

I'm perplexed about the other motif also: It could be either matsu (pine) or... aoi (hollyhock.) And the flying things could be either cranes or dragonflies...

Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:17 am

Kira M. M.

I was thinking cranes.. as they have a lil beaky hook, off the head.
but cranes mirgate in spring... no sign of dianthus then... or even the hollyhock...

so that leaves it as pines... but pines and dianthus??

*looks* BTW... have the two of us TOTALLY hi-jacked this thread??

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:17 am

Tahanala

Not quite, we're wondering about motifs, after all. Would there be another thread about "What the heck is this pattern?"

The birds could be pheasants, too, cranes don't have that long tail. Peacocks obviously do, but I've never seen them represented in flight, without any tail-eye display. If they are birds, they the plant is probably matsu, considering the scale.
I agree the spots and sticks look like ume.
The fabric seems quite thick, too.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:18 am

muhvi

These have been bothering me a while. I would be very happy if someone could tell me what flowers/plants are in these kimono/obi and their seasonality.


1. Could that flower be azalea?
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2. Is that orange flower same as the previous one?
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3. I have no idea what plant this is
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4.
Image

5.
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6.
Image


7. Are they just leaves or some specific plant? And the birds just non-specific birds?
Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:19 am

hibana

Muhvi, Maybe #3 is tachiaoi. #4 is a grape vine.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:20 am

Dagorwen

Hi! I've got a question concerning roses:
In this thread, they are listed as summer motif. But in the book review to Shigeko Ikeda's "Spring" book, she has them as flowers in two of the shown examples. How does that compute? Is she anticipating? Or are roses more "forgiving" in seasonality? They do bloom earlier than summer, but seasonal awareness or not, I feel that the wafuku rules aren't always quite in tune with what's out there in the garden. 8O

While I'm at it, another question: I've got a kimono (I think tsukesage, but am still arguing with myself) with sakura on it but it's unlined. Now no matter how I twist it, I can't fit sakura into hitoe. Am I supposed to line it myself? It's not karinui! I don't think the lack of lining is noticeable, though, the cloth is quite a tight weave.

A question that has bugged me for a while- what is the point of summer motives (= hitoe season) on awase kimono? Is there something that tomesode are always lined? I know the question has been asked before, but somehow there hasn't been an answer that I can find. :gah:

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:20 am

Peccantis

Dagorwen: hitoe tomesode do exist. I've always thought that awase kimonos with hitoe season patterns are meant for exceptionally cool summers or mountainous areas 9v9 Or then they are cleverly multi-season. Your sakura hitoe might be completely wearable in Japan at hanami time. I visited a year ago and by the time of plum, it was quite warm enough for hitoe (well at least for me).

And then again, seasonality is not simply a question of which flowers blooms when. There are yukata with snowflakes to evoke a relieving coll feel in a viewer, and the wearer as well, even though summer snow is quite rare. I could imagine a sakura awase worn in winter, with matching haori/michiyuki/something to "protect" the fragile flowers from the cold. Or a sakura awase as dônuki, flashing occasionally a tiny bit of flowers beneath a subdued winter pattern in anticipation of spring!

Roses might be even spring season if we want to consider them as "the official Valetine's" flower in our own cultural contexts so there. Heavens know I'd dress in blue, white and lions for November 6th if I had a wardrobe to match. It's not all about Japan, and the more we want to call us wearers of kimono as opposed to mannequins of kimono, the more we should be aware of our home culture and seasonality as well. IMHO.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:20 am

Tahanala

There also is the matter of the kind of "roses" we're talking about here. What is often called "Japanese wild rose" is yamabuki, kerria, and is totally different from real roses. It does indeed bloom around April, and its blossoms are yellow. It is even sometimes called Easter Rose.

I think Muhvi's image n°5 might represent it; on the other hand, n°4's leaves are very different from real grapevine ones, and the fruit aren't alike either. N° 1 and 2 do seem similar, maybe they are u no hana AKA deutzia?
Image

If so, they are late spring or early summer. I have a ro obi featuring some.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:21 am

muhvi

loreamar - Thanks for info! The kimono is lined and quite heavy, what might be appropriate season for it? Spring or autumn maybe?

Tanahala - Thank you! Finally I know when I can wear my tsukesage!

Here is another strange plant. If I would have to guess, I would say it is rice, but on the other hand the leaves look bit too wide and frilly for rice.
Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:21 am

Tahanala

This n°3 dark kimono cannot be tachiaoi, the flowers/seeds are way different. I have an impression they might be seeds, not flowers, so it would be autumn. Even without positively identifying it, I feel there is a plethora of spring flowers we all know that would be preferentially depicted.

Your obi looks suspiciously like millet to me, too. I considered amaranth, but their flowers fall down, and the leaves are way too long. Common Millet fits perfectly, though.
If I am right, it certainly is a very original motif, and I'd love to have one like that! Now if they could have it in nice sedate colours such as beige, brown, grey, and green...

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:22 am

Dagorwen

Peccantis, Tahanala: Thanks for your help! I like the concept of translating and enlivening the kimono in our own contexts. Still, before I adapt too much and perhaps sloppily I like to understand the orthodox views.

Peccantis, the idea of protected petals is a real nice one! It reminds me of how buds sometimes can be protected from sudden frost by encasing them in water drops that freeze. It is a beautiful sight!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:31 am

Kokoro

Image

Shippo-moyo
Cloisonne design, so named as the design is often used on cloisonne ware

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:32 am

onnagata

I'm wondering for a while now if there's a special meaning to the composition of momiji and ume :?
I haven't only seen kimono with this pattern, but also on scrolls/paintings, pottery and others.
So, I guess there might be a special meaning such as there's a certain meaning to pine, bamboo and ume: sho-chiku-bai.

When do you wear such kimono? Sho-chiku-bai is worn in January because it's a New Year pattern, although ume is a February pattern.

I even remember there were kimono on ebay with this pattern which were hitoe, so not really appropriate for winter/early spring.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:32 am

Peccantis

onnagata: maybe it's a sophisticated "everything is fleeting except the seasons" note? You can wear a momiji-ume hitoe in autumn to say "sure, cold danky winter is coming, but so is the fragrant spring" and in the spring to say "smell the ume before the bloom is gone; autumn will be here sooner than you think". My 2 yen.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:32 am

Tahanala

Momiji can also be a spring motif, when it is sprouting. It is more likely to be in green shade then, and its position to be different from falling leaves.

However, autumn-to-beginning-of-spring is often the most likely option. The you have the whole range of spring blossoms and flowers to choose from!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:33 am

onnagata

I've read somewhere on this forum that there is seasonality to different water patterns f. ex. flowing water, etc.
What about (sea) waves? (not seigaiha)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:34 am

Tahanala

I believe it is mostly winter. Is this the topic you were referring to?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:34 am

onnagata

Yes, that's it. Thank you!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:35 am

Auberginefleur
moonblossom wrote:Yay, time for another silly question. Would a koinobori motif be for April (anticipatory) and May (literal) or is it something I could theoretically get away with whenever? It's so cute. :coy:
moonblossom wrote:Thanks for the info! I'll just have to take it out and ogle it the rest of the year, or wear it where I know there's no chance whatsoever of running into someone who would know better.
I was re-reading this thread, and thought, how sad to merely ogle your beloved kimono for most of the year.

Even though late April to the first week of May (Boy's Day is 5/5) would be best, rising-carp is an auspicious motif of strength and good things to come, so I suspect you could wear it at a wedding (as a guest with well-wishes of healthy children for the bride--then again maybe that would be less than politically correct nowadays),
or in January as an auspicious motif for good tidings for the New Year.

Or, if you are not doing anything formal, what the heck, wear it whenever you want!

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:36 am

Fuyou

I'm stumped on these two kimono, can anyone help me out?

A Taisho/Showa komon with some leaf pattern I can't identify-
Image

A Taisho houmongi. I can identify the bamboo and bellflower on the bottom, but I don't know what those branches on top are.
Image

The answers are probably going to be obvious...

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:37 am

Tahanala

1 Lotus maybe?
2 I'd say nanten (nandina)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:37 am

Kikuyo

Is the 2nd one maybe flowering dogwood? We have some here on campus that look a lot like the motif on your kimono, but I can't find a good picture to do the shape of the leaves justice.
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Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:38 am

Fuyou

Tahanala, I think you're right about it being lotus leaves. That would also match seasonally, since the komon is hitoe.

For the second one, both the nanten and dogwood look like good matches, but the grouping of the berries and leaves makes me lean more towards dogwood. I couldn't really find a seasonality for nanten, and dogwood seems to be good for spring flowers and fall foliage, so I'm guessing this houmongi is good from autumn to spring...

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:38 am

Muhvi

Anyone know if herons are season-specific motif, and if so, what season? My guess for this kimono would be autumn, but am I wrong?
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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:38 am

Kokoro

Tahanala I havent found a clear answer about the seasonality of aoi but there is the Aoi Matsuri in May in Kyoto. They use hollyhock leaves for decoration.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:39 am

Chamekke

I don't know the answer to either aoi or herons, but you might try Googling on kigo list (or kigo saijiki) to see if there are any lists of kigo (seasonal words) that include these terms. Kigo lists are generally prepared for use in poetry, but they're valid for more general purposes, such as seasonality of design elements in kimono, tea utensils, etc. For example, there's The Five Hundred Essential Japanese Seasonal Words.

Hey - I just found heron on the following list, and it's included (unsurprisingly) under summer:
The Yuki Teikei Haiku Season Word List

The same list includes hollyhock under summer, which fits with Kokoro's comment about Aoi Matsuri since May is the beginning of summer in the Japanese calendar.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:40 am

muhvi

chamekke - Thanks for the info, but I think my heron kimono is not very appropriate for summer since it is lined. I am guessing maybe autumn, there seem to be reeds among the birds and they are quite autumnal, right :ermum ?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:40 am

Kokoro

Hmmm muhvi, your kimono looks quite wintery for me.
Kareashi (withered reeds) are a winter motive and as we know from other birds like chidori you use summer motives in winter to create a "warm" feeling.
Just my 5 cents :)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:41 am

muhvi

Kokoro - Yes yes yes thankyou!! Not another autumn kimono :katana: ! I love winter! For now I make it officially winter kimono! Shame I have to wait a year to wear it in correct season :P .

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:41 am

Koharu

Please help me identifying the pattern of this wool Komon I won recently:

Image

What kind of flowers are those? And is there a month they do apply to or is it for summer in general?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:42 am

Peccantis

It's mostly an assortment of ''karabana'', i.e. fantasy flowers, which don't have a season. There are a few parts with auspicious open and folded ''sensu'' (fan) (yellow area at lower left), and a two-part ying/yang type pattern that is sometimes seen as three-part and whose name I cannot recall. At far left, on yellow, is an auspicious "coin" pattern of interlocking circles (cannot remember name). There are some flowers that resemble ''ume'', ''kiku'', and ''sakura'', but combined with those imaginary leaves I'd say they aren't meant to denote seasonality.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:44 am

Peccantis

I just spotted an unpatterned kiribame komon on eBay. It was really dark blue/green + white.

Ok, I have a question now ^_^ This little awase pretty will be coming home when my personal koromogae has been at "NEED RO" for months, but in any case...

Pine cones, matsu bokkuri
Image

From having a good number of mature cones in our summer home's yard, I happen to know pines love to open and drop their ripened cones in middle and later July when it gets dryer and hotter. The obi however is awase, and I'm thinking pine cones as a winter motif isn't a far fetched idea. What say you guys? Does anyone have the know?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:45 am

Tahanala

I know matsuba are winter, so my uninformed guess would be that cone go along.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by Hikari » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:45 am

Hikari

Personally, I associate pine cones with winter and Christmas.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:46 am

Peccantis

Yes, pine needles are winter, but you shouldn't assume :wink: After all, water motifs span the whole season cycle: mist for spring, dewdrops, waterfalls and icebergs for summer, clear springs and ripples for autumn, crushing waves and snow for winter.

Continuing from Welcome to Kimono Anonymous.
rubyminky wrote:
Peccantis wrote:It's the first time I see pine cones on obi. Aren't they precious?
Those small-pattern Nagoya are always interesting to me, as the design looks like the old fashioned maru obi. Do you think they're formal? What do you plan to wear it with?

I have an obi which allegedly has a pine cone design, but it's so stylised, it's basically a shibori splodge. I think the seller (Ryu?) was a bit over-interpretative!
Do you have images at hand, I'd like to see!

It's fully orimono, so I was supposing it was a little fancy but not formal... But now that I look at the picture more closely (it's a thumbnail), there are ever so slightt golden threads woven in. So... Strictly speaking... :? I am reminded of "granny formal" with suitably subtle metalwork and *ahem* mature motifs with subdued colours.

I was fully intending to pair it with my oh-so-chic pine coloured granny cornered komon, too :oops:

Image
My taste is truly waaaay older than me Image

edit//forgot to add this thought, but this topic about hitoe komon with nothing but matsuba (!) reminded me - is matsuba that strictly a winter motif after all :?

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:47 am

GoldenPhoenix

Question... What season are peacocks? Or are they seasonless?

I always thought they were spring since that's when they grow their tails and start struting. I'm confused because I have a kimono that appears to have peacocks on it, but otherwise seems to be predominently autumnal. That doesn't make sense to me because peacocks loose their tails in autumn. This is the kimono I'm speaking of:

Image
Haoto - Showa Period Houmongi or Chuu-Furisode by Kurokami, on Flickr

And now, this has got me wondering... What season would I classify this furisode?

Image
Peacock Lady - Early Showa Era Furisode by Kurokami, on Flickr

Aside from the peacocks, I can't see any definitely Japanese motifs. I think the peacocks are the only thing that would end up defining the seasonality.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:50 am

claw789

I think the peacock is a borrowed, non-native animal and most books say it came to Japan by way of China. If my semi-feral neighborhood peacock is any indication, peacocks keep at least some of their tail plumage all-year round. Most items I've seen are lined and I honestly don't see many summer items with peacock motifs. (If you find a peacock-themed yukata I'm betting it's modern - and I want one.) Go with your gut if you think it's autumnal.

Japanese Hou-oo comes from the Chinese Fenghuang, a chimera of many birds including pheasant, duck, peacock, crane, etc. It's considered the Emperor of all Birds and doesn't really bear any resemblance to the Egyptian phoenix myth at all, but are rather considered auspicious and all-seasonal. Where the Chinese would depict them with paulownia and bamboo, the Japanese used grasses and flowers. You could wear peacocks to a wedding because it resembles something auspicious, sure.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:50 am

rukichen

so you would say pheonix is non seasonal ? I would like to know , cause I got this red tsukesage with some pheonix on it.

The colors are very bold but shiny and the pheonix has some golden ebroidery. The flower look like peony to me, which would be spring.
(I'm still looking for an obi for this)
Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:51 am

SuzumeOdori

From the huge kimono motif site I hope to get around to fully translating at some point:

"Auspicious Motifs (Kisshou Monyou): ... These motifs are not seasonal and can be worn year-round."

The Phoenix is included in this list. :) The Phoenix design "gracefully increases the auspiciousness (of an outfit)."

http://wabiji.web.fc2.com/learn/8.htm

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:52 am

Kokoro

I thought phoenix was a spring motive.
But this might be in combination with kiri no hana (paulownia flower). As the paulownia tree is the only one the phoenix lands on these motives are often combined :)

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:02 am

chamekke
bebemochi wrote:There are a bunch of motifs that, for some reason, are present on both summer and winter items. Crashing waves, chidori, and fishing bets seem like purely summery things, but you see them on winter things all the time. Ditto snowflakes in various incarnations; you see them on summer things all the time.
I think it's about invoking whatever temperature you aren't feeling at the time. Summery, beachy things make you feel warmer in the winter, while snowy, wintery things make you feel cooler in the summer.
The nami-chidori (wave and plovers) motif can be used for both summer and winter. Based on my extremely limited experience, I think that when the chidori are charmingly stylized (think Pontocho) and when the waves/ripples are gentle, it's likelier to signify summer. (You may also see other motifs, such as jakago and fishing nets.) When the chidori and waves are more naturally depicted, and perhaps also when the waves are crashing or "violent", it's likelier to signify winter.

For example, I have a kurotomesode with nami-chidori motif, but it's miles away (in terms of feeling) from a summertime yukata with white-and-navy nami-chidori:

Image

Image Image

Incidentally, I found a textual reference for chidori in wintertime. In Sasaki Sanmi's Chado : the Way of Tea : A Japanese Tea Master's Almanac, Sanmi locates chidori as one of December's kigo or seasonal words. He specifically mentions its "mournful" voice. I remember reading elsewhere (but can't recall where!) that cites the desolate sound of plovers' voices on a deserted beach in winter. For sure, the images on the kurotomesode above SCREAM winter to me - there's nothing remotely summerlike about them.

As opposed to, say:

Image

Image

...and even this lovely old shibori yukata:

Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:03 am

moonblossom

I've also got a nami-chidori kimono, my five-crested irotomesode. It's got big violent crashing waves, but Ponto-cho style chidori. It's heavy and fully lined.

Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:03 am

Kokoro

I can ad some water examples

Taka (hawk) with crushing waves - Winter

Image

I did know that taka is a winter motive but I wasn´t sure about the waves.
This thread is quite helpful :)

Sakura with running water and water wheel - Spring

Image

Ro obiage with shidori and water - Summer

Image

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:04 am

chamekke

I'm honestly not sure how much one can generalize about the waves (I was making a generalization and hoping to be contradicted!).

But, it does seem that "cute", Pontocho-style chidori = summer items, while more "realistic" (naturalistic) chidori are likelier to appear on winter items.

Of course colour may play a part in distinguishing one from the other, too.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:05 am

chamekke
Tahanala wrote:And, basically, if it's heavy and lined, it is likely to be meant for winter, while ro items are probably more appropriate for summer! :P
Er, yes, well there's that too...

*stubs toe in dust, abashed*

(Hee!) :lol:

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:06 am

Sekhet

This motif as I undestand is water, what Season is it?
As for the name of the motif, I can`t spell it in English, and the translator is not helping, dont know the japanese name neither, so please write...

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by Hikari » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:06 am

Hikari

I believe those are whirlpools (Japanese: uzumaki) and they are a summer motif.
Someone should double-check me though.

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Re: [Knowledge] Seasonal Patterns/Kanzashi

Post by IG Team » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:06 am

Tahanala

The fabric seems to be ro, too, so you're pretty certain it is appropriate for sumer.

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